Tuesday, 15 July 2008


In my desire to see open and clear democracy in the China Gateway Scheme prevail in Thanet, regular readers will know that I have not criticised China or its governance. It is now time to perhaps remind those who accuse me of racism elsewhere about some history.

For those ranting and raving on another strand on Strife, be assured that this strand will have nothing to do with kicking peasants off their land in China without compensation to build Olympic villages or factories; repression of the religious and culltural life of the ethnic Tibetans; the supply of weapons to Sudan to enable genocide; the supply of arms that are used against British troops in Iraq and Afganistan,;the repression of democracy in China; Chinese 'colonialism'; economic 'warfare'; exploitation of workers or the fact that modern China is an unpredictable time-bomb that could go bang.

Instead, I want to take you back 40 years to 1968 and to what the Province and national Leaders of 'Modern' China might have been doing in their youth when some of you of my age were having the occasional joint and crooning 'All You need is Love'.
Our PM, Chair of SEEDA and various TDC 'visitors' will have met some of them whilst visiting China last November and this April.

The leaders of today's China would have only survived the upheaval of Mao's Great Leap Forward and the Cultural Revolution by being part of it; have no doubt. Let me quote loosely and directly from Mao- The Unknown Story by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday.

The most harrowing item for me from their book of horrors, was a 'rich capitalist and revisionary peasant farmer' who in 1968 was dragged out of his Guangxi home to dig a grave and then bury his 6 and 7 year old son and daughter alive in it; all the time 'Revolutionary Guards' were shouting abuse and waving their 'Little Red Books'. His crime had been to try and sell some fresh produce privately.

The authors describe some of the goings on in Inner Mongolia in 1968 when today's Leaders of China were young teenage 'Maoists'. Let me quote " cases included a Muslim woman having her teeth pulled out by pliers, then her nose and ears twisted off, before being hacked to death." The number of people who 'suffered' in some way was later put officially at over 1,000,000- of whom 75% were ethnic Mongols which meant that at least 60% of all Mongols in the province - men women and children were plunged into hell.

What's my point here? It is this. Have no misconceptions about the background of those you wish to do business with. The men in positions of power in China had an interesting youth and we can easily ignore that fact at our peril.


Anonymous said...

Anonymous, I think bertie's intention is merely to highlight the inherent danger in dealing with the Chinese Government. I feel sure there is no way he could be considered to be racist or have a political agenda. Perhaps he'll get back to the real issue here and that's 'Do we want China Gateway at Manston? Good idea? Yes or No?'

He's made it clear his answer is 'No' and it would seem many agree with him. The whole scheme is another way the Chinese are waging an economic war by flooding the world's markets with their goods thereby undermining much of the industry in the West.We no longer have to worry about Chairman Mao's Red Guards with their 'little red books' but Chinamex sending shiploads of goods to our shops. How often have you bought something to discover that logo underneath Made in China?

Tony Beachcomber said...

Annon 15:58, I don't believe that Bertie has changed direction at all, in fact all he has done is state proven fact. The Chinese government in my opinion has evolved into a unpredictable state capitalist machine that exists with one purpose to make money and achieve economic dominance just like any other multi national organisation. The only reason Chinese goods are on our markets is because they are so cheap and they dampen down inflationary pressures on our economy.Which goes some way to explain why inflation across the economy is 3.8% yet food and fuel costs are soaring away. To proove a point I cannnot imagine poundland going out of business in the next few years.
Getting back to Berties point, I also beleive it is a dangerous game to allow the expansion of Chinese imports into this country, taking into consideration its track record around the world.

Unfortunately this is not a valid planning objection.

Bertie Biggles said...

Keep this up, 15.58 and i will keep taking you down.

You are clearly very much in support of China Gateway and those proposing to cover farming land and our water catchment area for a very healthy profit. I admire your attempt at what the US Military call 'black propaganda' or 'psy-ops' but not here please.

It is interesting that you failed to query any of the facts on this strand but seem prepared to bring your specious and baseless allegations from an earlier strand here. I was waiting to see who would post first on this item and how interesting that it should be you?

Are you being employed to do this?

It confirms for me that 'Strife' is clearly beginning to air issues that others would rather not have brought into the open and to be subject to scrutiny.

Bertie Biggles said...

22.13,22.18, 22.23 and 22.27, you can carry on with your pernicious hate campaign or get on with commenting on this strand.

If you feel there is cause for complaint then report it to the appropriate authorities and let them decide on the issue. I am sorry, but I cannot allow you to continue this hysterical and unfounded diatribe about 'racist remarks' and 'racist comments'.

If you saved my original post on the other strand then copy it please to the authorities and make a formal complaint. I would love to argue this case in a court of law.

I notice that you fail to comment on the points I make on this strand about the teenage years of the present Chinese leadership at many levels (national and provincial). Why is that?

Anonymous said...

censorship rules bertie

Bertie Biggles said...

You bet, 23.44, when unfounded malicious allegations are being posted like confetti! Sorry, but that's the way it is at the moment.

Michael Child said...

On the subject of it being racist to mimic accents being mostly white and English I sought the opinion of a friend of mine this morning, he is an Indian born in Kenya, now an English citizen.

As when one bounces ideas around with an expert, a simple solution came up quite quickly.

Terry Pratchett is arguably the greatest living writer of humorous novels and a millionaire, in his novel Good Omens which is a parody of the Just William books, he writes mimicked Japanese in much the same way Bertie wrote mimicked Chinese, so anonymous too many times to mention, why not sue Terry he probably has a lot more money than Bertie.

Michael Child said...

10.55 if you would or for that matter any Chinese or other people from an ethnic group who felt a victim or that Malcolm or Bertie were truly being racist, would like to email me or pop in the shop to confirm your identity, then I am happy to attempt to sort this one out.

I recommend coming into the shop as I have just acquired a copy of the North China Hong List for 1917, which is an interesting and unusual book, and well worth a look for anyone interested in China.

Good Omens is a modern book and still a best seller so I don’t think we can be said to have in any sense moved on from its time.

However the real issue here is that the EA have set much lower safety standards for protecting all of us from having our water supply contaminated.

If you look at OLTH/95/0838 you will see that in 1995 much higher standards were set for the use of this land and safeguarding the source protection zones, these standards are not being set for F/TH/08/0400.

The balancing ponds that were insisted on for the 1995 industrial developments on the site and not now, have a function that is not available with soakaways, and that is if there is a spillage of poison in the lorry parks the fish and other wildlife in them is killed, this serves as an indicator that the water in them is unsuitable to go into our reservoir.

Anonymous said...

13.05 That is a bit of sidestepping from the issue in hand is it not. I am amused at how a thread about the Chinese Government has now turned into a tirade regarding racist attacks on Chinese people - you are not making sense - but then you don't want to make sense because you wish to deflect readers from the issue at hand - namely China Gateway. On reading through this blog I find no reference regarding fear of Chinese people, however, there is concern regarding the sustainability of the Gateway given that it will rely on the economic and political will of China. Is this a good basis on which to build - in both senses.

Bertie Biggles said...

Michael and 13.17, I am sorry if your comments may now seem disjointed and unconnected but this site is currently subject to some strict editing by yours truly.

I have removed the same multiple 'spam' item alleging I am a racist with others this morning and I am not prepared to accept specious offerings 10.55, 12.27, 12.47, 13.05 and 13.15 making the same allegations but disguised in an anti-China Gateway guise.

Anonymous said...

Someone is losing the plot here.
I first visited China and Hongkong as a student in the 1980's, and fell in love with the place its hetitage, culture and people. My travelling companion had spent the previous year at Peking University - Bei Da. The academics there had all suffered terribly during the cultural revolution , but never discussed, as they had all had equally horrific tales to tell(like those above) however occasionally they opened up to trusted outsiders who had not shared in their suffering.
A few years later I had a Chinese resercher , Dr. Xui living as my lodger here in Thanet and we watched together as the Tiannaman square tragedy unfolded. We had all naively thought that China , not eastern Europe, would be the first country to throw off communism as as the economy was liberalising at such a rate. Alas it was not to be . We watched events unfold together , as the tanks and soldiers moved in and the slaughter and round ups began. He wept uncontrolably as his hopes for his beloved China were dashed.
It is not racist to celebrate cultural and racial diversity. It is not racist to support people being oppressed by their own totalitarian government and it is not racist to to share a joke and a laugh over national foibles - where would british humour be without the joke about the englishman, scotsman and the irishman all.....

Anonymous said...

bertie, a councillor would have to declare an interest and leave, having pre determined theissue, presumably yo will not be or speak at the meeting?

Bertie Biggles said...

Bertie of course is a fictional character, so does the rule apply?